what made Marvel great

The bottom line is that all the comics describe events that really happened. Realism is everything. Realism does not subtract from the fun, it adds to it. Realism is what made Marvel great.

Grim and gritty is not realism

Realism is often confused with "grim and gritty," meaning, more extreme violence and heroes who break the rules to get things done. Grim and gritty can never be realistic, except in "what if" stories where they all die or retire, e.g. Watchmen. This is why:
1. With extreme violence, soon every hero would be either dead or crippled.
2. Antiheroes (e.g. the modern Batman) are only sympathetic if they never make mistakes. heroes who never make mistakes are unrealistic.

Stylized battles are more realistic

Superpowers are dangerous. one wrong move and you're all dead. Where superpowers exist, wars become largely a matter of posturing, to intimidate but not to kill. We see this in the Cold War: nobody dared use nuclear weapons in anger, so the goal was to intimidate without escalating to mass death. So stylized superpowered fights are more realistic than simple attempts to kill the enemy.

Shaka Zulu

Superbeings are like the old Zulu tribes. Battles involve a lot of posturing and spear shaking, and warfare can continue for generations. But then Shaka Zulu came along, and he focused on more efficient killing. So he quickly defeats everyone and stability ended. For a stable costumed population you need to have wars based on proving your ability, not based on blood. As soon as a grim and gritty leader appears (like Shaka Zulu) then the game is over.

So for superheroes to exist, the only realistic kind of battle is the flamboyant ritual fighting of the silver age, not the bloodletting of modern times.

Hollywood is not realism

Many comics have gone down the dead end of Hollywood style snappy dialog. But clever minimalist dialog is no more realitic than compressed didactic dialog: real conversations are somewhere in between.

Many comics are also seduced by Hollywood glamor: characters inhabit a world that their readers do not. An early example of this is when DC depowered Wonder Woman to make her more like Emma Peel. But her world of high fashion and money was no more realistic than her world of ancient gods. A Kirby street scene, full of ordinary people but only one amazing thing, is more realistic:

Retcons are not realism

Modern Marvel editors have sacrificed realism in favor of merchandising. It is justified as preserving what the characters "should" be. For example, recently Tom Brevoort ended Spider-man's marriage by using magic, and fans complained that this was not realistic. In his blog in January 2008, he explained:

"Most of the best comic book series are about something--something that may not factor into every single last adventure, but which is the underpinning of the series as a whole. Fantastic Four is about family. X-Men is about prejudice. Batman is about revenge. And Spider-Man is about youth.

"Youth is the element that defined Spider-Man back in the days when he was created, the thing that separated him from all of the other competing superhuman crime-fighters and made him unique."

That just isn't true. Youth has never been part of Peter Parker's personality. Right from the start he was the family breadwinner, the head of the household, one of the top photographers of a major newspaper, and he wisecracked and acted like an older guy. Read Fettinger's excellent essay for details.

Defining elements change. Brevoort says that Batman is about "revenge." Tell that to the millions of fans of the 1960s TV series. Brevoort's says the Fantastic Four is about "family." That wasn't obvious in the days when the Marvel Universe was being born, in the years before Reed and Sue married, when they lived in separate houses.

These things do not underpin the character. Worse, by keeping the characters the same you destroy the real underpinning: realism. Doc Nebula explains why so I won't repeat the arguments. Eric Larsen puts it succinctly:

"I guess that’s part of the reason I stopped caring. It wasn’t just that every character seemed to get a new voice and personality and face and physique when handed from one creative team to the next, but often everything that came before was ignored, contradicted or written off as somehow not real. It’s at a point where I can no longer believe that these characters are the same people anymore and it’s to a point where I can’t get caught up in their adventures because I know that somewhere down the line, whatever had happened will be tossed out the window just as everything else had been countless times before. "

The wimp's excuse "but it's just a comic"

Some people mumble apologetically "but it's just a comic." Shame on you! Demand more! The early comic writers and readers treated their comics seriously, and the result was better comics!

Stan Lee told us again in teh 1980s: realism

"From its very first issue, the Fantastic Four seemed to herald a turning point in comic book lore. And, if you can keep a secret, I'll tell you what I suspect the reason to be...

Realism! Hey, I know that 'realism' sounds really silly when talking about super-powered costumed characters who can stretch like rubber bands, burst into flame, become invisible, and tear a Toyota apart single-handedly. But I'm sticking to my guns! [...] I'd say to myself, 'Okay, so I can make my body become a flaming fireball and fly through the air. Fine. But, given that ability, how would I act in the real world?"

And there you have it. The secret our competitors would have paid a fortune for. But remember, you took a pledge, your lips are sealed."
" - Stan Lee, 1987, introduction to Marvel Masterworks Fantastic Four

Stan Lee told us again in the 1990s: realism

"You probably heard this story: I wanted to quit at that time. I was really so bored and really too old to be doing these stupid comic books; I wanted to quit. I was also frustrated because I wanted to do comic books that were—even though this seems like a contradiction in terms—I wanted to do a more realistic fantasy. Martin wouldn't let me and had wanted the stories done the way they had always been done, with very young children in mind. That was it.
...
I would think that one thing that made our work a little different from anyone else's is the fact that we tried to make our characters as real and believable as possible. Even though they were in fantasy stories, our formula always was, 'What if somebody like this existed in the real world, and what would his or her life be like?'"
- Stan Lee in 1998, interviewed by Roy Thomas

Superheroes? In the real world?

Modern Marvel heroes cannot exist in the real world. As Peter Gillis explains: "It's a fundamental disconnect to think that a world with teleportation, undersea races, mutant nations, and gangs of superheroes would still have Paris Hilton as a celebrity focus. In fact, people living on a consistent Marvel Earth would have a culture almost unrecognizable to us: Instead of being the Crown of Creation, they'd be living with the knowledge that we're a not-very-evolved backwater planet with a sorry excuse for technology--and that immortal Gods exist and periodically tear things up. The supernatural would be a certainty, as would the afterlife--and America would have no sense of security at all, with giant robots marching through the countryside. If I were to actually craft a background that jibed with the Marvel Universe foreground, America would far more resemble Mughal India than our world of high cholesterol and YouTube."

In contrast, early Marvel heroes could exist in the real world, and they showed us how to do it:

1: Limit their powers

Most of the early Marvel heroes could be defeated by ordinary people. The Thing could not lift more than five tons (at first). The Human Torch could be defeated by a bucket of water, Spider-Man had to run from the police, and the Hulk was always running from the military. Any more powerful characters (Thor, the Watcher, the SuperSkrull etc.) spent most of their time on other worlds or otherwise unable (or unwilling) to interfere.

There is no need for power inflation. If you know a man who can lift five tons, that's exciting! But if you know a man who can lift five thousand tons, it's impossible to relate and the story becomes dull.

2: Limit their numbers

In the early days there were fewer than twenty superheroes. It was possible to believe that maybe they existed out there in the real world. But modern Marvel boasts of more than five thousand licensed characters. You real world connection has been lost.

3. Big events all happen in secret

Nearly all the big events in early Marvel happen in secret. So you can believe that maybe they really did happen and the 1960s news cameras either missed it or hushed up (as they did with JFK's affairs).

* When the Sub-Mariner's giant sea monster crashed onto New York all the people had already been evacuated (FF 4) - all they saw were broken buildings and evidence of a freak tornado (created by the Torch at the end of the story).
* When the Sub-Mariner's Atlanteans invaded New York it took literally minutes, and all his people were forced back into the sea a few hours later without a single shot being fired (see FF annual 1, pages 20-25). This was in an era when people were more likely to accept the government's explanation for things, so to avoid panic they could easily have said that the Atlanteans moving down the main street were just a parade.
* When the Mole Man threatened to lower every major city into the earth, all he actually lowered were top secret nuclear plants or single street blocks.
* When Galactus almost ate the Earth, most people just saw strange weather events, and a giant on top of the Baxter Building, which the newspapers said was a publicity stunt.
* When the Skrulls invaded, only four aliens reached earth so nobody really noticed. Sure, the government noticed, but they hushed it up.
* Dr Strange did cosmic things, saving the whole world, but using spells so that ordinary people are completely unaware.

After the Marvel Explosion in 1968 other writers took over, invasions got bigger, powers got bigger, and realism became impossible

Objection... what about the early Hulk?
But what about the early Hulk?" In issue 2, page 14, and issue 6, page 12, we see events that were known to the whole world (the toad men invasion and the Metal Master's global activities). The letters pages show that the readers wanted believability, but these stories were not believable. Result: This was the only early Marvel comic to be canceled due to poor sales. When the Hulk later came back he had smaller scale adventures, and sales soared!

4. No Prizes for guessing how they did it

If Stan ever wrote something that was unrealistic he had the perfect solution: the No Prize. If you see anything that doesn't make sense you are invited to think of a clever explanation and then you get a (no) prize! Not only did it guarantee that all stories made sense, it increased the readers' connection with the stories, which is the whole point of realism!

The superscience and Fantastic Four technology pages of this web site are in the spirit of the No Prize: You think that the comics don't make sense? Sure they do! Hey, Stan, I want my No Prize!

Jack Kirby told us: Realism

Kirby drew the most amazing characters and events, yet they were always completely believable:

"My stories were true. They involved living people, and they involved myself. They involved whatever I knew. I never lied to my readers."

"I saw my villains not as villains. I knew villains had to come from somewhere and they came from people. My villains were people that developed problems."

"Y'know, for comics to be effective they have to mirror life in some way. You've got to make them high drama. You gotta make them - not fictional, but you've got to dramatize, like what you see in Captain America."

"If you analyze them, you'll find that I'm not really fictionalizing. There's a realistic ending, there are realistic circumstances, there are realistic beginnings and consequences"
(source)

This realism extends to every detail that Kirby drew::

"...Reed and Sue's casual clothes on page 2 and the Thing's sweater on page 8, and Sue taking the baby from Crystal on page 2. These seemingly minor details make the FF seem like real people, and were a big part of the sense of family fans felt reading the comics of the Lee/Kirby era.
The very lack of this type of storytelling detail is one of the reasons the FF has never reached the heights it attained while Kirby was on it."
- John Morrow, introduction to "Fantastic Four: the Lost Adventure"

This is what inspired the best of the next generation:

"What Kirby offered to me as a reader was both his tremendous visual imagination and his ability to
integrate incredible superheroics into the most quotidian of urban settings.
...Favorite moments include Thor climbing into a taxi cab and chatting with the driver, and Jack spending a half page showing normal folk on the street—cops, kids, etc.—reacting to Galactus on top of the Baxter Building. His world was very much our world, and his superheroes were very much a part of it."
(- Chris Claremont)

Critics told us: realism

This is from salon.com:

"It was important that Lee's heroes lived in the real world, and not in Gotham City or Metropolis, because they were real people. That is, Marvel Comics imagined how real people might act if they suddenly gained superpowers -- confused, conflicted and not necessarily eager for the responsibility. They were a departure from that straight-arrow hero of the Golden Age, Superman. The next age belonged to Marvel. And Stan Lee ushered it in with his creations."

This is from a CNET business network article:

"When Lee's heroes are not defending the earth from weird menaces, however, they lead lives much like other New Yorkers (Lee's stories were set in the real world, not fictional cities such as Metropolis). They have trouble hailing cabs, get razzed by teenage toughs, chat with the mailman, and even lose money on the stock market--and young Peter Parker has to juggle typical teen problems with fighting super villains"

This is from one of the first newspaper articles about Marvel, from the Herald Tribune back in 1966:

"Comic book super beings had mighty powers but no personality—not until Stan Lee tried out the Fantastic Four in October, 1961. The whole new tone of Lee's vision to bring human reality into comic books was set in an early F.F. appearance. (All Marvel characters quickly pick up affectionate nicknames.) This super crime-fighting team was evicted from their Manhattan skyscraper HQ because they couldn't get up the rent. The stock market investments that paid their laboratory bills had temporarily failed. The Fantastic Four, who appear in their own comic book and guest star in other Marvel publications, are beset as much by interpersonal conflicts as by super villains."

This is from the Zone:

"..as if they were happening in the same world inhabited by the readers. This is underlined by Lee and Kirby's introduction of the real world into their fantasies. In #9 the F4 go to Hollywood and the issue features guest spots from, among other, Dean Martin, Bing Crosby and Bob Hope. The dialogue is peppered with contemporary references and Kirby and Lee themselves turn up..."

Steve Ditko told us: Realism

"I prefer conflicts that are based on reality rather than based on fantasy.
When you get wound up with super villains, super fantastic gadgets and super incredible action, everything has to be made so deliberately that it all becomes senseless." (source)

For more about the problem of unrealistic superheroes, see the discussion of power inflation, below. The driving force behind Ditko's storytelling was his desire to be true to a standard. In his interview he speaks about this at great length. For example:

"The biggest thing influencing my style would be that I see things in a certain way and that means handling everything so that personal point of view comes across. ... [every man must constantly] struggle to keep his mind from being corrupted and being ruled by irrational premises. ... The Question and Mr. A are men who choose to know what is right and act accordingly at all times. Everyone should." (ibid)

Note that Ditko had no problem with science fiction elements, but in every other way a story had to be true to reality. This appears to be why Ditko eventually left Marvel:

"Comic book historian, Greg Theakston has theorized that Ditko saw Spider-Man as a semi-autobiographical piece, and that Ditko had personal ties to the character. In fact, one can draw a great deal of similarities between Ditko and Peter Parker. Ditko was a shy and mild-mannered student, who wore glasses and was very smart. He was not the most popular student in school, and often kept to himself— sound familiar? According to Theakston, whenever Stan tried to inject any changes into the strip or change the direction of the stories, Ditko felt slighted, crushed. This was in a round about way, about him— his views, his feelings. Ditko was not going to be told how to handle a character he created and molded after his own life and views." (source)

Tolkien explains realism

Tolkien probably knew more about fantasy than anyone. In his essay "On Fairy Tales" he gave the right way to approach it:

fantasy must make perfect sense within its own world.

Why? Because

the purpose of fantasy is to let us see our own world from a new perspective.

This is why we need continuity. By making one part unbelievable we make it whole thing unbelievable and thus pointless. And this is why it is dangerous to be too stylish: it is not our world. We cannot relate.

Suspension of disbelief?

Readers with low expectations often appeal to the suspension of disbelief. This shows a fundamental misunderstanding of the concept:

Coleridge had faith in his stories

Coleridge invented the term "suspension of disbelief:"

"that willing suspension of disbelief for the moment, which constitutes poetic faith"

Notice that last part? Suspension of disbelief is a form of faith. Faith means you trust that something is real, even though you don't analyze it. Coleridge was talking about his poem the Ryme of the Ancient Mariner, because it refers to spirits. Coleridge believed that spirits were real, and he was asking his audience to just accept it for now, because they could discuss the details later.

Horace wanted explanations

The Roman poet Horace is credited with an early example of suspending disbelief in his ars poetica:

... et idem indignor quandoque bonus dormitat Homerus
(... and yet I also become annoyed whenever the great Homer nods off.)

He is saying he does not like it when a writer falls asleep on the job and includes inconsistencies. Horace, like any good reader, wants his stories to make sense! (Luckily Homer's mistakes can easily be explained away by saying later copyists made mistakes, just as The Thing complains that Stan and Jack make him look uglier than he really is.)

Shakespeare was reporting real facts

Shakespeare asks the audience to overlook problems in Henry V:

"[...] make imaginary puissance [...] 'tis your thoughts that now must deck our kings [...] turning th'accomplishment of many years into an hourglass."

Notice his explanation: he's reporting the acts of real kings, and merely compressing the events in time. It's the same explanation as used in the Thing story: these are real events, and any problems are due to editors who have to fit the constraints of the medium.

The modern version of "suspension of disbelief" is nonsense

In modern times, "suspension of disbelief" has been twisted to mean "we don't care about this part." But this just causes more problems. If you don't care about one part (e.g. Superman's disguise) why do you care about other parts (e.g. he can fly)? If you chose to accept one part as nonsense then you pretty soon have to accept everything as nonsense.

Tolkien and Marvels

Tolkien explained the whole purpose of marvels (he was not referring to comics, but this applies to all fantasy). Marvels exist for us to marvel at: to make our minds expand and race, not to shut them down.

"since the fairy-story deals with 'marvels,' it cannot tolerate any frame or machinery suggesting that the whole framework in which they occur is a figment or illusion."

(Note that this refers to drama: a lot of comedy relies specifically on breaking rules.)

Modern comics reject realism

Remember that quote from Kirby?

"My stories were true. They involved living people, and they involved myself. ... If you analyze them, you'll find that I'm not really fictionalizing. There's a realistic ending, there are realistic circumstances, there are realistic beginnings and consequences"

Contrast that to the views of Tom DeFalco, who was editor in chief when the Marvel Universe died:

DeFalco: People have often said to me “I don’t read SPIDER-GIRL because it’s not real!”
(laughter)
Interviewer: Like SPIDER-MAN really is real?!
DeFalco: And I’m like “Uh, guys…”
(laughter)
Interviewer: What did Alan Moore say? “This is an imaginary story… but aren’t they all?”
DeFalco: Aren’t they all! And Alan, as he often does, just nailed it.
Interviewer: Nailed it.
(source)

Kirby and Ditko and Lee kept it real. Modern writers rejects that view.

"Superheroes by their very nature are absurd, and the more you try to explain them, the more absurd they look." (Dave Mazuchelli on the back of the Batman: Year One hardcover)

Notice the difference?

Conclusion

The strength of Marvel in the 1960s was the same as the strength of all great fantasy drama: incredible exploits and down-to-earth realism. The more incredible and real you can fit into a comic, the better it is. And those early Marvels were pretty darn good.